BDSM and the Law

Midnightwolfling · Nov 24, 2009

I have spent the last couple days looking through threads and using the search function and have not come across any thread that this question would fit into. If there is I am sorry for re-posting it.

I guess will have to give a little history on how this came about. M'lord had a girl friend before He moved out here. They had been together for 3 yrs but their relationship had been going downhill fast. They both had an agreement that they could have partners online to fill in the needs that couldn't be met with each other. After Him and I started talking they fell on hard times and I offered them my home. His ex wore his training collar. They talked before they came out here, an ultimatum was laid out for her and she was fine with Him collaring me. To make a long story short that in the two months she actually lived in my house she made things very difficult, causing fights and the 3 of us sitting down and having talks late at night after my kids went to bed. The last night she was in my house she was told that we were going to have a talk and that she was to keep a reasonable tone. Needless to say she kept screaming and woke my kids so He put her in her place. To make a long story really short, he wound up going to jail because of her and is now on probation. One of the requirements is that He attend Domestic Violence classes.

These DV classes are presenting a problem with who we are. They teach that the lifestyle we love and choose to live is wrong. Where is the fine line of what is right and wrong? His counselor told him that we have to keep it strictly to the house and what not. We found out also that anyone could turn him or me for that matter if they see either of us swat on the ass or in my case have my hair pulled. I have gone to wearing my collar around my ankle so it isn't noticeable.

I have tried to lay his fears to rest but still at a loss as to what to do. We did some looking on the net and if someone did turn us in it wouldn't hold up in a court of law. They look at is that he coerced or threatened me and vise versa.

Any suggestions on precautions we should take? We don't want to give up something that means a lot to both of us.

sarah555 · Nov 25, 2009

i don't understand. How did the police get involved in the first place if it was just bdsm play? So what happened to the other chick? You mean she went crying to authorities when your master punished her?
And even then, if it's consensual, the authorities have the right to regulate it?

Sparrow69 · Nov 25, 2009

the best way to cover everyone's position is a legal written agreement signed and notorized, that details the very worst that you are willing to subject yourself to. The major issue is that their are kids in the house, and if they are of questionable age, it could be ruled child endangerment.
best bet, is to sign the agreement, make sure your kids understand (if they are old enough to ask questions), and keep it out of public eyes until the probation and class is over. The class will continue to tell him its wrong, because its a deviation from the norm, but this system was built by prudes, so you get what you get. All he needs to do is play ball, go through the class, and remember, there is nothing wrong with how he feels or who he is, unless he actually hurts someone against their will. Best of luck.

ReallyGreen · Nov 25, 2009

A signed and notarized contract IS a good idea, but not a guarantee of anything. Lawyers from any side will point to coercion because S&M is illegal in most jurisdictions. Since domestic violence doesn't even require the "victim" to press charges, having a signed contract for illegal activity (and S&M is illegal in most places) is doing nothing but digging your own grave with prosecution.

I've said before that mentally and emotionally unwell persons are drawn to BDSM like beetles to carrion. If your partner is showing ANY signs of being less than five by five I strongly advise you to LEAVE that relationship yesterday and use the experience to better screen your future playmates.

pepeluism · Nov 27, 2009

There's definitely a double standard and it doesn't bode well for your situation. In my experience, if a woman is being abused, it's such a bad thing that nobody cares whether she wants to be part of that or not. I have known of 2 situations where masters got into a lot of trouble for this sort of thing. One of them got beat up as he humiliated his slave in public. Imagine that.

Lucky for me, nobody cares if a guy gets humiliated/abused in public. I did once have a lady call the police when she saw my Mistress kick me in the balls when we were at the beach. I was on all fours looking for something under a bench and she came from behind and kicked me an started laughing. It looked pretty bad. When the police came we explained our "relationship" and they laughed and left.

JLM

Master of puppies · Nov 27, 2009

I once asked a cop friend why two guys can't have a fight if they wanted to, out of the way somewhere, and he said it was because even though the participants were willing, this could be used as an excuse to hurt / intimidate someone weak.
'He/she was asking for it officer, honest'.

Midnightwolfling · Nov 28, 2009

sarah555 said:
How did the police get involved in the first place if it was just bdsm play?

She called them. She even told the police that I tried to attack her but that got thrown out. She was spiteful because M'lord chose me over her and she broke the ultimatum that they had agreed to before they even moved out her.

sarah555 said:
So what happened to the other chick?

Nothing happened to her. She moved out into one of the local hotels her and not more then a few days later one of the "Masters" that we all know moved in with her.

sarah555 said:
You mean she went crying to authorities when your master punished her?

She wore His training collar as well. In the two months that she was in my house she never made an effort to even try to make him happy. She never helped around the house.

sarah555 said:
And even then, if it's consensual, the authorities have the right to regulate it?

Yes they do. Whether there is consent or not it is against the law. Contract or no contract, in the state of Wyoming it is illegal.

Sparrow69 said:
the best way to cover everyone's position is a legal written agreement signed and notorized, that details the very worst that you are willing to subject yourself to. The major issue is that their are kids in the house, and if they are of questionable age, it could be ruled child endangerment.
best bet, is to sign the agreement, make sure your kids understand (if they are old enough to ask questions), and keep it out of public eyes until the probation and class is over. The class will continue to tell him its wrong, because its a deviation from the norm, but this system was built by prudes, so you get what you get. All he needs to do is play ball, go through the class, and remember, there is nothing wrong with how he feels or who he is, unless he actually hurts someone against their will. Best of luck.

Thank you Sparrow. My kids are not ready to hear about this. 10 & 5 and being as I went through a nasty divorce, the ex would love to find any excuse to take them from me. We try to keep things to the indoors but sometimes when emotions run high, things get out of hand. *sheepish grin*

ReallyGreen said:
A signed and notarized contract IS a good idea, but not a guarantee of anything. Lawyers from any side will point to coercion because S&M is illegal in most jurisdictions. Since domestic violence doesn't even require the "victim" to press charges, having a signed contract for illegal activity (and S&M is illegal in most places) is doing nothing but digging your own grave with prosecution.

For us it goes both ways considering we are switches. All in all tho he would get into trouble and I wouldn't. Most all cases that we read on the net about this, even with a contract it didn't hold up in court.

BDSM and the Law

Midnightwolfling

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sarah555

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Sparrow69

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ReallyGreen

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pepeluism

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Master of puppies

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Midnightwolfling

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