What's the difference?

Discussion in 'General BDSM discussions' started by subspace, Dec 25, 2009.

  1. subspace

    subspace Member

    I hope this doesn't sound like a completely obvious question but several posts have referenced 24/7 slaves and 24/7 subs and this had left me wondering.....What's the difference? I know how subs and slaves differ but if you are a sub 24/7 then aren't you awfully close to being a slave?
     
  2. Sparrow69

    Sparrow69 Moderator

    Close, but no cigar. There's an old saying.. "Close only counts in horseshoes and hand grenades."
    Typically, its the overall level of commitment and dedication on both parts. A slave, surrenders all rights, and enters into a lifetime agreement (a la level 9) and a 24/7 sub still retains the rights to terminate sessions and have limits. (level 7 and 8)
     
  3. subspace

    subspace Member

    Does this mean that slaves do not typically use or are allowed safe-words, or am I mixing up safe-words and scene termination?
     
  4. My slave has a safe word. If he uses it, things are stopped immediately and it's looked into as to why he used it and then it's at my discretion whether we continue or stop. A safe word is vital in all play... even a 24/7 slave can only take so much (at first anyway ;) )
     
  5. Sparrow69

    Sparrow69 Moderator

    exactly. we still use safe words, but the stop may only be temporary. once the situation is assessed, then it is determined whether to continue or not. in a sense the safe word changes meanings... instead of" stop," it becomes "i would like to consider stopping if it pleases you"
     
  6. kittengrey

    kittengrey Member

    -has no safe word- uh....yeah. Anyways

    would a non-24/7 slave still be considered a slave? Since obviously they still have rights, just outside the scene. Or is it just that there is no non-24/7 slave since there can't be a full submission of all freedoms due to the cut in lifestyle activity, and anyone not 24/7 is just considered a sub (if that makes sense)
     
  7. Sparrow69

    Sparrow69 Moderator

    in my book, no. while a sub can be called a slave, by definition, they are still a sub until they have no freedoms. while one of mine still attends college, she does so because i told her to. She also gets the minimum grads i told her to get, eats what i tell her to eat, wears what i tell her to wear, and attends classes I selected. So does she still have a life outside the scene, yes to some it would seem so. but to us, since she makes no decisions for herself, then i say no.

    this reverts back to not all scenes being sexual in nature. just because shes not naked and being flogged, doesnt mean the slave isnt under the command of her dominant.
     
  8. fuggles

    fuggles New Member

    so how can a sub be 24/7 when they are not giving up their entire life? If they are making decisions for themselves then how can their relationship with their master be 24/7?

    a 24/7 slave seems obvious, but a 24/7 sub seems somewhat subjective and/or arbitrary.

    one distinction maybe 24/7 subs have some freedoms that are pre-negotiated.

    my perception is there is a wide grey line. i agree with one author on the subject who made a point about labels. labels are good/useful if we all agree on the definition. otherwise they are somewhat meaningless.
     
  9. Sparrow - I can't help but wonder where I would fit in your classification. I have certain freedoms, but, within guidelines set by My Lord. For example, I choose my own clothes, but, under the rules of what he finds acceptable/pleasing and wishes me to wear. I make certain day to day decisions, but, within the bounds of his rules and guidelines. I often choose what to make for dinner, but, do so in accordance to what he likes, or wishes for me to eat. Same applies for going out with friends. He allows me to go out and meet people, but, under the rules that he knows where I'm going and with whom and the knowledge that he holds ultimate veto power to that as well if he feels that a person or situation is not appropriate.

    I think the biggest thing is my job. I have full discretion when it comes to my career. He provides guidance when and where appropriate, but, for the most part, my career is mine. I would say the same applies to my son as well. He definitely has input into things pertaining to my son, but, ultimately, those decisions are mine as well...

    I guess my feeling is that a Master does not have to make every minute decision, but simply provide the rules/guidelines/expectations that their sub/slave is to act within and allow for decisions to be made within those boundaries. Does this negate it from being considered 24/7?
     
  10. subspace

    subspace Member

    This seems to be where you fit best MLML

    Maybe not so much as meaningless but open for interpretation and gives those of us who like to use labels/categories to help sort and organize information. I dont expect any clear cut black and white answers but I am interested in how individual Dom's and subs view the difference for themselves.

    Welcome to the forum fuggles!!
     
  11. Sparrow69

    Sparrow69 Moderator

    Fuggles - your distinction is exactly correct. the written agreement i share with my subs allows them certain freedoms, and these agreements are for 1 year.

    MLML - I do believe Subspace answered it best. Given that you have some freedoms to choose on your own, even though they are within guidelines, they are freedoms none the less. i would classify you as a sub, not a slave.
     
  12. fuggles

    fuggles New Member

    Thanks. Good to be here. I hope to contribute and learn something. I'll properly introduce myself later.
     
  13. kittengrey

    kittengrey Member

    i suddenly feel downgraded -.-
     
  14. lol Why do you say that kitten?
     
  15. subspace

    subspace Member

    If you have seen yourself as a slave and suddenly realise that by definition you are a sub it may be a bit of a let down. Just remember that the only thing that is important is that you and you partner are satisfied with the level you are at. There is no point in going further than is enjoyable to you or him just so you can carry around a label. Slave does have a nice ring to it but a subbie is what I am too.
     

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