Questions About BDSM and Marriage

Discussion in 'General BDSM discussions' started by Newlydom, Sep 2, 2011.

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  1. Newlydom

    Newlydom New Member

    Hey guys, I'm a newbie here and looking to get a some advice and get a few things off my chest, but first, a little background. Please also take my views of the BDSM world with a grain of salt, since I am very new to this world and have a lot to learn.

    I'm a 21-year-old man living in Charleston, SC. I was raised in a very Christian household, single mother, with a very good childhood. I was brought up to believe that women are God's perfect gift to man, and hold that belief to this day. However, to my family, respecting women basically meant letting them do whatever they want, and that doing anything to assert authority was blatantly wrong. This conflicted greatly with my view of a respectful relationship, where I lead a woman in a relationship through firm authority. I have always wanted to LEAD a woman through our relationship, with her having complete trust in me and I in her. I have constantly wanted that responsibility, for her care and needs to be met by her trust in me. My family basically told me that my view was "disgusting" and "disrespectful" when I went to them for help. This has led to an internal struggle within me for years, leading to mild depression and social anxiety.

    Recently, however, I have discovered the world of BDSM. My first instinct was that this was the "disgusting" world that my family detests so much. But after reading into some of the relationships that are built from this life, I knew that this was what my heart always desired. My heart has always wanted to be the leader in a relationship, and I crave the astounding level of respect and trust that can be built in a dom/sub relationship. My heart absolutely CRAVES it. When I discovered this world, I felt like a huge weight lifted from my shoulders. I felt truly happy for the first time in months. My heart knew that this is where it belonged.

    There are still a few things that I am still conflicted about, and hope that someone here may have a few words of advice. My main conflict regards marriage. Through my Christian upbringing (and I am still a Christian, and still hold all my beliefs), I determined that I would NOT have sex before marriage. Yes, that means that I am a virgin. I will never break that promise to myself. I want to be absolutely positive that I am pouring my heart and soul into one woman that I truly love. This seems to conflict with the way most people join this world. From my limited reading and observation, it seems like most people who enter this world start with casual encounters and make it more and more permanent. I cannot enter a relationship that way.

    The obvious question that arises from this conflict is: can it work that way? Has anyone entered a vanilla dating/engagement/marriage relationship with the understanding that it will become a loving dom/sub relationship? Is this an unrealistic expectation? My biggest uncertainty comes from inexperience. I have only had 2 dating relationships before that failed fairly quickly. Being new to this world, what could I look for in a woman that would show that she wants a relationship like this as much as I do? It seems that very few women see me for who I am, and even fewer would want to enter into a dom/sub relationship.

    I apologize for writing a full-length novel, but I would greatly appreciate any thoughts on this situation. Writing this out has helped me get a few things off my chest, and I appreciate anyone who listened. Good night and happy playing!
     
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  2. sebastian

    sebastian Active Member

    Hey Newly. A few thoughts about your situation, in no particular order.

    1) Power exchange, which is what BDSM is, is a fundamental part of the traditional Christian marriage, in which the wife submits to the husband, although BDSM takes it rather further than most would expect. But the two things are very compatible.

    2) It is possible to do BDSM without sex, assuming that we define sex as traditional penetrative activity. It does limit you options for play, but you could do pain play, for example, without penetration. Doing BDSM without touching the sub's genitals is trickier, but could be done.

    3) That said, delaying sex until marriage, although it is a beautiful sentiment, is actually a predictor divorce. It encourages people to marry young, before they've really figured out what they want. Sex before marriage actually correlates to longer marriages. Just thought I would point that out.
     
  3. subarama30

    subarama30 Member

    I agree with Sebastian that not having sex before marriage is great in theory but in reality it could really limit your options. It will be very difficult I think to find a sub willing to forgo sex completely until marriage. Also until you have had sex and experimented you won't know what works for you and what doesn't. You might find that what seemed great in your mind just doesn't do it for you in real life.

    I think there would be a danger of rushing into marriage just to have sex as the temptation can be too much.

    Having said that I am not saying it is impossible to achieve what you say you want just that I think it will be a challenge. Perhaps you need to re think the whole no sex thing. There are pain lovers who don't necessarily need penetration to enjoy themselves but what happens when you are married and she wants the pain and not sex but you do?!
     
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  4. sebastian

    sebastian Active Member

    That's exactly why waiting until marriage is considered an indicator of divorce.

    Just yesterday, I played with a boy who was desperate to meet me. He really wanted to explore being submissive, and we'd done a reasonable amount of cyber play. He finally worked up the courage to play, and within 15 minutes of starting, the boy decided that he didn't enjoy being submissive as much as he thought he would. So we ended things. So people can change their minds once they start actually playing, and it would really suck for Newly to get married and then realize or have his sub realize, that BDSM wasn't really for him/her.
     
  5. Aibo

    Aibo Member

    I have been into BDSM for very nearly 3 decades now, with one 12 year relationship - part of it cohabit. And 10 years on second place, again part of the time we lived together.

    But marriage is one perversion way out of my league, to far out for me to try. So I cannot give any input on that.

    Now as for the conflict between christianity and the BDSM world, ok I been there myself.
    And, you will not like this answer the slightest.

    In my youth I prayed to jesus and god for years to have this 'curse' lifted from me, so that I could become normal vanilla whatever.
    Nothing happened, then my father died unexpectantly just when he started to get some parts of his life back on track again.
    Well bottom line is that after that I lost faith completely.

    Yet Christianity and BDSM is perhaps not always mutually excluding each other, only nearly so.
    I did note one chatroom named Christian BDSM on one IRC net, so you might want to check that one out instead of reading my pessimistic view.

    One thing leaves me quite befuddled to say it diplomatically, you list as male, and talk about a woman to love - but say you are a 'virgin'??????

    A female is a virgin until the hymen gets ripped the first time she have intercourse. (Though it is known they can cheat and have it restored by hymenorhaphy surgery.

    Now a man have no hymen, it is a null word for a male.
     
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  6. Knots

    Knots Member

    Virginity is a subjective idea, not a concretely defined term.
     
  7. Somewhat on topic, yet going off..

    I agree that virginity can be subjective..

    As for the marriage/Christianity/BDSM lifestyle conflicts.. Much of religion is a form of D/S, as its more conforming to another's standards and rules, to be punished and disciplined when stepping out. How one would come to terms with BDSM and their religion, I can not offer any input. I that with more understanding of yourself, your religious needs and interest, and this "world", you may find a more defined answer. Good luck.
     
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  8. Smallest

    Smallest Moderator

    I'm focusing on this quote below. I don't really care whether or not you wait for marriage for sex, that's up to you. Also, we have a couple married couples and a few people who identify as Christian on this forum, I just haven't seen any of them hop in yet.

    I would not suggest going into it completely vanilla, then changing after marriage. That just sounds kind of abrupt and strange. Many elements of D/s can be done without sex. You can choose what she wears, have her cook for you, punish her if she messes one of those up (of course, assuming she's consented to the whole thing and doesn't just think 'yay I'm cooking for him and he likes this dress'). You can have power exchange without sex.

    Of course, you could go into it a bit less extreme before it built into harsher pain play, or 24/7, or whatever, that's normal, but I wouldn't go into a relationship like 'okay let's be vanilla for a while, then try BDSM (although that happens with a lot of couples unconsciously, it's not great as a conscious decision).

    And I'm imagining you do at least kiss and such with your prospective partner. If it's more than a chaste kiss, which I'm mostly sure it would be, that is, if you're 'making out', you can add some elements of more sexual BDSM- hold her down, tie her up (actually, you don't need any physical contact with bondage, if you're content to look), blindfold her, etc.

    Look for women who seem naturally submissive, liking direction, etc, and eventually, when you're comfortable with eachother, breach the topic that this kind of relationship interests you. Most will be somewhat interested, at least out of curiousity for what it's like. You could also look at collarme etc, SM dating sites. If you end up in a relationship with a woman who seems vanilla, ask her about it. You probably wouldn't be that compatible in a vanilla relationship either if you both had dominant personalities, so there's a fair chance she'd like to play a submissive roll.
     
  9. Newlydom

    Newlydom New Member

    Thanks for all the advice! I'm learning more and more about myself and this world every day and really appreciate the input! The main reason that I decided not to have sex was to make relationship decisions better, but if I am better served with a more sexual relationship before marriage I could do that. Thanks especially to Smallest, your comments really put more perspective on my situation to me.
     
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  10. Smallest

    Smallest Moderator

    I assumed it was not sex before marriage for religious reasons, but if it's because you're worried it'll make your relationship decisions worse, I agree with the others that sex before marriage is actually likely to be good.

    Obviously you should just play things like that by ear though, I don't think setting times for things like sex (marriage wise, or after 3 dates or an amount of time or whatever)generally works well for either party.

    Welp, good luck anyway.
     
  11. WrathofThor

    WrathofThor New Member

    I think it's definitely possible. I too identify myself as Christian (despite the screen name... haha) although I don't belong to a formal organization of any kind and the way I practice my beliefs is heavily influenced by eastern religions. I'm one of the lucky ones that found my girlfriend in a vanilla relationship and we both discovered a kinky side to one another that matched very well. Looking back, there are so many things that attracted me to her that would hint at the relationship having the potential to be more than vanilla, but I didn't know that at the time.

    However, I wasn't looking for any particular kind of relationship structure or power dynamic when I found her. I believe firmly that although we choose our path, our paths also choose us and with right action and faith our desires will come to fruition if we open ourselves to infinite potential. So, from my experience, it's definitely possible. And I agree with Sebastian that the traditional Christian view of marriage is compatible with BDSM so long as it's monogamous.

    However, neither my girlfriend or I were celibate before meeting one another and each of us have had multiple sexual partners before getting a feel for what we like. When looking for a partner, I didn't impose too many restraints and had a much greater chance of finding someone. Is it right for me to assume you want someone who is also a virgin? That will drastically decrease potential partners in today's society. Once you decide you want someone who wants a D/S power dynamic, you're further decreasing the options by an even larger amount. Although the two aren't incompatible in theory, I think you're going to find your target is a small percentage of the population.

    Are you interested in the power exchange in the relationship itself primarily, or does the sexual element of control also play a role in this? If it's only in the relationship then you might have a better chance, but if you're trying to find a sweet Christian girl that wants to be tied up and let you shove toys up her ass at your leisure then God bless your search! :)

    My advice would be to pick which is more important to you, the sexual aspect or the religious aspect, and focus on one. You'll never find the ideal relationship because they are all based on trade-offs, so find what is the most important criteria and start looking there. You might find a a girl who is everything you want but isn't a virgin, challenging your beliefs. Or you might find a girl who shares your beliefs but not your kinks, challenging your animal nature. Good luck with the balancing act!

    I don't want to make this a theological discourse, but my personal belief is that God created us with genitals with the intention that we use them and love them, because we are sexual beings by nature. I believe the so-called religious "rules" the Bible lays out are guidelines for health and society in the time period they were written, but not spiritual LAWS and must evolve as healthcare and society evolve. We have birthcontrol, pasteurization, and access to anti-bacterial products which make many of the guidelines about food and sex redundant. Also, since the Bible outlines guides for dealing with slaves, does that mean the Bible condones slavery? Another outdated concept. Jesus said NOTHING about these things, only love one another as our maker loves us.
     
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  12. Smallest

    Smallest Moderator

    Thor, I like our input. I hope Newlydom's still around to read
     
  13. Nuka

    Nuka Member

    You can even do a play on Christianity in a scene if you want, the whole penance thing and self flogging...

    One good thing about being a Pagan in the BDSM community is that there is this cermony called the "Great Rite" which is essentially where blessings are said by the priest and/or priestess and then everyone leaves and the couple have sex basically.

    So think about how you can use your faith in a scene.

    In regards to marriage and abstaining, I'd say it's a mistake. Myself and ashlie are actually engaged but that had nothing to do with sex, it was a personal life choice. But we were having sex before we ventured into BDSM together, and because we already knew what worked, it made the transition a lot smoother.

    The best thing as many say on this site, is to communicate. Communicate your thoughts and feelings to your gf/sub/whatever and talk it through. What does she think? What does she suggest? What does she want to do.

    Find a compromise between what you and her want, as well as between your own person takes on faith and sexuality.
     
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  14. kajmir

    kajmir Member

    The only thing I'll ad is:

    It's your life...It's a shame they find it disagreeable...however it's not reasonable to expect anyone to live their life for other's views and morals...

    I also agree with those above...it's nice to say you want to wait...so the wedding night comes about and you both realize sexually you're incompatible and you're married for life.

    While BDSM or any other relationship isn't purely about sex...it does matter.

    I dated a catholic guy...I loved him...6 years. He was everything I wanted but in the bedroom. I was his first.

    He was pouty, childish...unbending, any suggestion no matter how kindly worded was like some personal attack....sexually...it would have been a bloody nightmare. (The whole time, not just the first night or week)

    Prolly no help but something to consider.
     
  15. Smallest

    Smallest Moderator

    I agree with Kajmir that it's your life, but I'll also add that it's not like they have to see it.

    Also, Kaj, that sounds terrible. I understand he must have been good in other aspects, but having to cope with that low self esteem all the time, especially sexually...
     
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