My wife is submissive while I am Vanilla to a degree

ShadowMasta · Feb 8, 2010

I recently found out by accident that my wife of over 5 years has recently found a need to be in an online D/s relationship with another man. Although she has told me her desire to experiment in this sort of things, she still will not totally open up to me especially by the fact that she has a Dom. I know she thinks that I won't understand and that I will overact and based on my current feelings maybe she is right, I just feeling be totally honest no matter how scary is better than hiding things from me. I guess what makes it more complicated is that I know more than she thinks I know so maybe while she thinks she is not hurting me she actually is doing just that. I love my wife very much and am willing to experiment in all these sorts of things with her but she has told me that she doesn't see me that way. It hurts me that she does these things with another man, it feels like cheating to me even though from my research I understand that it is more complicated than that, that there is a need she needs filling and maybe rather than leaving me she is doing this instead. I will never be comfortable with her being with another man. She thinks I am being ridiculous when I voice my concerns about having a D/s relationship saying she isn't exactly going out and F#@$@ some guy for real but regardless an online D/s relationship with another guy to me is just as much an emotional F@%@% as is a real F@%@%. We have introduced toys into our relationship and I have shown her that I can satisfy her cravings to a degree just not 24/7. I would not be comfortable with her doing this in real life even if there was no sex involved, I just feel that is stretching the boundaries of marriage. I am however very willing to learn and participate with her. I feel that there needs to be sacrifices from both of us. She can't have everything she wants in life, there needs to be comprises. I have refrained from exploding so far even though it has been killing me (sore heart, physically sick, sleepless nights), instead I have been trying to research the topic as much as possible to try and understand how she feel's. Lately I am trying to show trust in her and am not watching over her in a hope she might open up to me. I have thought of therapy for me, I don't think she would go, she see's it as there being something wrong with her although I don't think there is, I just want us to discuss how this is affecting both our lives and how to deal with it. I guess my biggest issue is her relationship with her Dom, she wears jewelry to show that she belongs to him, a secret bond between the 2 of them, and that is eating me up inside especially that she is hiding it from me

Well thats my story. Advice and comments welcome

sebastian · Feb 8, 2010

Shadowmasta, I'm sorry to hear you're having difficulties with this. The issue of on-line d/s play is complicated. It may or may not involve explicitly sexual fantasies. For example her dom may simply be ordering her to do non-sexual or semi-sexual things simply to prove her obedience. On the other hand, it's possible that they are playing out sexual scenarios of various sorts. Regardless of which it is, I think you have a right to feel concerned. Clearly the idea of your wife being dominated by another man is upsetting to you. You feel like she is cheating on you, even if she is not physically cheating, and since you're half of your marriage, your feelings are valid and I think you have a right to demand that your wife discuss this situation with you and listen to and respect your feelings. Marriages, like d/s relationships, require a lot of communication and honesty to work properly, and from what you've said, your wife is not currently communicating with you very well. I think that were I in your situation, I would feel much the way you do, especially if I thought my own relationship with my partner were suffering as a result.

So my advice would be to find a way to talk to her openly about why she is doing this. As cliche as it sounds, when you talk about your feelings, try to phrase it in terms of how you feel and what you think. Don't say "you're cheating on me with this guy"; say "I feel like you're cheating on me with this guy." The reason I suggest this is that your wife may well disagree that she's cheating on you, but she cannot disagree with the fact that you feel like she's cheating. Approaching the issue in terms of how you feel about what she's doing will force her to think about your reactions and what you want and not simply about what she wants. And by the same token, you need to listen closely to what she says she wants and what she thinks she's doing. She may honestly not see what she's doing as cheating at all, especially if she's not playing out sexual scenarios with this dom. But clearly she's looking for something that for whatever reason she feels she can't get from you.

Marriage is about compromises, so if you and she want to stay married, you and your wife are going to have to figure out some way to compromise about this issue. It sounds like you're willing to look for compromises, so hopefully when she understands how distressing this is for you, she'll be willing to compromise as well. There are all sorts of possible options here. Perhaps she will agree to accept domination from you instead of this other dom, or perhaps she will agree to accept domination from you if you will let her continue with her dom electronically. Perhaps you will agree that she can play out non-sexual scernarios with him but not sexual ones. Perhaps she will agree to let you read her emails so you know exactly what she is and isn't doing, or maybe she'll be willing to let you participate in them in some way. Perhaps her dom will agree to train you so that you can provide what she's seeking.

Counseling is certainly an option. However, if you do go that route, try to find a kink-friendly counselor. (I know there is a website that lists some.) Many therapists are still moderately hostile to d/s activities and may approach them as something that needs to be 'cured'; given that your wife is already defensive about this issue, getting a therapist who views submission negatively would probably make her feel attacked and undermine the therapy. As odd as this may sound, you might look for a therapist who has experience with gay clients. In my experience, gay therapists and those who have worked with gay clients tend to be somewhat more receptive to alternative sexualities and less likely to tell your wife that her desire to be submissive is the problem. If your wife refuses to go, you might still seek a few sessions for yourself to help you figure out how you can address this problem.

I think you might also ask your wife what she actually knows about her dom. Domming online is very different from domming in the real world; it takes much less skill and experience (which is not to denigrate those who enjoy and are good at it). And it's easy for a person to misrepresent himself or herself online. The Uber-dom Prince of Darkness that your wife knows might actually be a pimply 16-year old virgin (or a pimply 40-year old virgin for that matter). So she might not be reacting so much to him as to the fantasy of him in her mind. It's hard for you to compete with that fantasy because she sees you all the time; she hears you snore and fart and knows all your other less flattering features. Ask her to let you communicate with him. If he (assuming it's actually a man) is really a competent dom, he ought to be willing to discuss the situation with you. Doms often think in terms of property, and a real dom will recognize that you have some claim over your wife and that he at best is sharing that property with you. Personally, if a sub I was working with was in your wife's situation, I would order the sub to seek permission before continuing with me, but I suppose some doms might not worry about that.

Good luck with this. Let us know what happens.

EZRA · Feb 8, 2010

Educate your self as thoroughly as possible.
I know you have indicated that you are doing this, but you can understand her needs and possibly find a way do to this if you understand what is going on.
I suspect that you lean to the submissive side of this particular equations( this is not to say you are submissive but rather a Dominate would already have dealt with this in a much differnt manner that you currently are.
Is so all is not lost and it has been my experiance that submissive can have good and fulfilling relationships with each other,in fact it seems like they naturally form close relationships with each other.

I ant you to change your outlook on BDSM as you approach this proplem,instead of thinking about it as something you do,,think of it as more of a state of mind.
I consider BDSM'rs to be gourmets and take pleasure from the more subtle aspects of sex and relationships.
If you think about it honestly how many of your relationships have actualy been egalitarian?

As fundamentally "vanilia" you have a choice about the roll you play,but laking a strong desire to dominate or submit you will have to learn how to play the roll you chose.

I agree with sebastian about having to compete with a fantasy, submissive much more than Dominates have difficulty with separating the fantasy from the reality.
I also agree with him about contacting the Dom in question( i actualy agree with most of what he said) if he is a consciences Dominate he will be willing to share his knowledge with you and help you learn how to Dominate as you try to fulfill her needs as a submissive.
You might also find a experienced submissive who you can talk to and help guide you as you try to communicate with her.( we sub's can be a bit difficult ,when we feel our needs are not being met and our partners don't understand us.
She is hurting and dosent feel like she can please you and feels like you don't want her as she is as strange as that may sound to you now.
She also dosent feel like it's "ok" for her to be the way she is, so she has been suppressing it and hiding it but it always comes out so the online thing...

If she will agree to a part time sort of "play" then I think there will be a basis for a good working compromise.

But just as you have heard already, good open comiunication is absolutely critical here.

Good luck and I aplaud your willingness to understand instead of just condem.

Mistress_Andrea · Feb 9, 2010

This is a tough one for me. My personal opinion and how I'd look at it if it were my husband.. I'd see it as cheating and lying. She's getting pleasure from another man (different than what an average friendship would provide).. be it sexual, emotional, whatever.. she's getting deep meaningful pleasure from another man and when she hasn't discussed this with you at all beforehand.. didn't even give you the chance to be that man before she looked elsewhere... whatever her reasons... in my book it's cheating. And she's been lying to you about it... whatever reason she has for not telling you about it.. it's still lying and deceit and if you are going to build a solid marriage or attempt to build a solid D's relationship out of it, you can't be wondering all the time if what she's telling you is the truth.. a half truth.. or a complete lie. Where does her obedience to him end? where's her limits with him? You say maybe she's doing this with him instead of leaving you, but if he orders her to leave you? Orders her to come to him? Will she obey or will you be enough to keep her there? She's wearing his jewelry.. markings that she's his.. in my book that is NOT ok when you haven't given your consent. Are you always going to wonder if she's thinking of him when she's with you.. what about those times she turns you down for sex? Is it because he ordered her not to have sex or something similar to that? In a sense, this man has a heavy hand over you as well and what you are able to do with your wife. Nope.. I wouldn't like that one bit.

That being said.. sebastian did give you some really good advice and while I'm not sure how well counseling would work for this situation unless you were able to find a VERY understanding therapist, you ARE going to have to find a way to make something work that you both can be happy with... she IS going to have to talk to you about this, because the only other solution isn't a pretty one.

InnocentFacade · Feb 9, 2010

Very well said Andrea.

Online relationships are much more meaningful than someone who's never experienced one can imagine.

Sorry I can't add much, I just wanted to throw my half a cent in the mix.

L8NightQ · Feb 20, 2010

I agree with Mistress Andrea on this one. Before you take the advice on the other stuff you're gonna have to MAN UP and call it what it is. She has a relationship with another man. No matter how much you learn about the scene and her nature, it's obvious that she responds to power. She's wearing a "chain" for him.
And if I'm understanding your post correctly, you're carnying all the weight for what she's doing to you, and your relationship.
Stop it!
Stop carrying this load. Stop accepting her fantasy and her behavior.
While it is true that we cannot control who or what we are attracted to, we can control, and we do bear responsibility for, what we do about it.
If you need to, get in touch with him and tell him that she is your wife and that you don't want him in your relationship.(I have a feeling you have that ability, right?) She may be his slave/sub or whatever, but you're not. I wouldn't necessarily blame him, sounds like it was her choice in seeking this relationship.

Sebastian and Ezra have very good insight and advice. That's why this response is short. If you can get her to stop, and get her to respect you... then you might have a chance at moving on their suggestions, but trust me... She won't respond to your internalized suffering.

I am telling you this cause you asked, and I'm giving it to you straight. I feel for your situation but I've seen this before, from her side and from yours.

Whatever happens please remember this.

She has wronged you (if not, you wouldn't feel this way)
In the long run, you have TWO (2) choices:
1 - Correct the situation, get the counseling, get the honesty, and really try to get through it.
2 - Accept that you guys won't make through this, and do what's appropriate

Many people take the 3rd choice - Stick around and make them wish you left.
Number 3 does not work.

I wish you well.... I really hope you can work things out.
Let me know how it goes.

WmaGuy · Feb 20, 2010

InnocentFacade said:
Very well said Andrea.

Online relationships are much more meaningful than someone who's never experienced one can imagine.

Despite the tremendous effort and advice offered by others, this is the post of the thread...I always scratch my head when I hear/read people say things like: "It doesn;t mean anything honey - it's just the Internet"... Distance and electronics cannot subvert the heart...

smlatent · Mar 11, 2010

ShadowMasta - your situation is very similar to mine. Except my Wife actually had real relations with the other man!

Being sick, lose a stone in 2 weeks, can't sleep etc etc etc. Been there too.

We have one choice, you and I. That is to do what WE want. If we want to dominate, we should do it. Rise above those around us and drive the heart of our wives. Or, if in turn they are weak, leave them to their lives of sexual unfullment with whom they *think* loves them.

L8NightQ · Mar 11, 2010

Well said smalatent.

Dom-me · Mar 11, 2010

Shadowmasta... What a horrible position to be in, my heart goes out to u mate. As a 'victim' of marital adultery myself I feel ur pain - and yes, your wife is having an affair, maybe not physical but definitely emotional and mental and they are worse.

As a sub who has been unable to act on my position until recently I can understand your wifes feelings to find a Dom IF U WERENT WILLING TO LEARN but seeing as u r and have told her so there must be more to this than a simple online fantasy. I'm sorry but her constant denial to allow u to learn and experience this with her tells me what she is experiencing with this online 'Dom' means more to her than what she actually saying. And that's sad because a divided heart is one that will crumble. She will have a choice to make at some time, the question is: are u prepared if it does not go the way u hope?

I am currently in an online relationship with a Domme and I know how real it can be as we learn about each other, trust each other and look toward a 24/7. Online can be just as, and sometimes more, pwerful than a physical relatonship.

Again I'm sry, but u did ask.

As a sub, I can say that I wouldn't be putting my trust in this Dom if I were ur wife - if he knows about u that is. As a sub I couldn't be with someone I did not feel wholly in trust to or respected by and if this guy does know about u and doesn't care then He does not fully respect ur wife and that can be very dangerous. I agree with the others he should be asking for ur approval first before doing anything with your wife. But again that's if he does know about you...

Follow the advice of the others and keep communication open and honest, and be patient. That's ur best weapon in all this. And u have one advantage - a strong one - that the online Dom does not; history and a physical prescence.

Good luck mate. My best thoughts are with u.

My wife is submissive while I am Vanilla to a degree

ShadowMasta

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sebastian

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EZRA

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Mistress_Andrea

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InnocentFacade

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L8NightQ

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WmaGuy

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smlatent

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L8NightQ

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Dom-me

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