Making BDSM/Sex Toys (Medical Professionals Please Advise)

Discussion in 'General BDSM discussions' started by Krills1138, Nov 23, 2009.

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  1. Krills1138

    Krills1138 New Member

    Hello all, this is my first post here and I apologize but it is going to be a long one. My wife and I have been into kink for a long time and have tried a whole lot of things. I’m into metal working as a hobby and we have talked about making our own sex toys. Now that I have gotten really good with crafting metal I started experimenting a bit. Before I get too into it I was wondering if anyone knows of any health safety issues I should be aware of?

    I decided on using 99.99% pure copper which is equivalent to medical grade, and have also done some pure zinc as well. Yes the copper can be pricey, but is also beautiful and fun to work with. I also know that Copper-specific metal allergies are INCREDIBLY rare and that pure copper has a natural biostatic property (meaning bacteria cannot live or grow on it) so it seemed a good choice.

    I have done exhaustive research and most credible sources seem to say little about harmful effects. I poured over forums and read all the relevant threads on “budget and DIY sex toys†but nothing has quite nailed it. I am actually creating a toy, not just looking for a household object that can double as one. There are some medical devices made from copper such as The Copper T 380A contraceptive http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intrauterine_device and I’ve seen plenty of videos where all kinds of things are inserted into various places. But, I’ve never had the chance to see or hear if any ill effects happened as a result. We are always very safe when we play, so I am not looking for BDSM safety tips, or the obvious “make sure there are no sharp edges.†Just some info pertaining to any possible adverse physical reactions one might get from using/inserting various materials.

    I’ve made a few really wicked prototypes all of either pure copper or pure zinc. If it’s safe I might even try some aluminum, chrome plated steel, or even highly polished wood. I could make anything from Dildos, vibrators, anal plugs/beads, ring/bit gags, spreader bars and other restraint devices. Any advice or previous experience with this would be greatly appreciated, as we are anxious to try them out. Thanks….
     
  2. Sparrow69

    Sparrow69 Moderator

    I currently work freelance with a company that makes specialized sex toys for a select niche market. I've seen many nice wood creations, made of burl-wood, walnut, or cherry. as for metals, Ive seen several nice examples as well. the struggle seems to be to use softer metals such as copper and zinc, or safer metals such as surgical grade steel. while the coppers feel better, the porous nature of the metal does allow the possibility of viral contamination, where as the hard nature of surgical steel does not. I'm more then willing to help in any way possible.
     
  3. Krills1138

    Krills1138 New Member

    Hello Sparrow, thanks for the response.
    I was thinking the same thing, that copper would feel better because it’s softer. The viral transfer thing might be a problem if you we’re using it on more than one person at a time, but then again so would just about any material. However if infected with a virus or bacteria and left overnight copper is much safer because it will actually kill the infectious agent within about 8 hours, steel will not. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1855605/

    I too have seen some very nice wood dildos, but there are just some things that you can’t make with wood. I wanted more of a challenge and want to create something more like a work of art. The company that you work with sounds really cool, what do they use?

    That is also why I posted this under general discussion, I was kind of hoping to get some info on what devices people would like to see, have or own. The problem with buying bondage gear is that the big and specific things are hard to find. Good luck trying to find an anal hook or spreader bar at your local adult video store lol. Of course there is always eBay, but (IMO) a sex toy is the kind of thing you want to see in person before you buy, especially if you are going to drop $100+ on it.
     
  4. Martello

    Martello Member

    Honestly, my advice to anyone is unless it's 316MLV do not stick it in you. Wood, semi acceptable because wood contains it's own natural antibodies.

    Also as a side note, in so far as "feeling better" it's bondage, for many people the lack of comfort is comforting.
     
  5. Krills1138

    Krills1138 New Member

    Not to be oppositional but you put all kinds of things into yourself everyday that aren’t made of surgical steel. You eat, drink and cook from ceramic, plastic and metal dishes and use flatware made from materials that are a far cry from pure. There is gold, silver, copper, nickel ect. body jewelry that is inserted through your skin or worn for extended periods of time. Most women use tampons which are un-sterilized cotton wads, and we all wipe our ass with a fist-full of bleached paper. Not to mention all the sex toys on the market that are made of glass, plastics and silicon, ohh and brest implants. Plus the medical devices I already mentioned, and all the copper steel and PVC plumbing that carries the world’s supply of potable drinking water. Your opinion or preference may be for 316MLV but that certainly doesn’t mean nothing else is safe for insertion.

    Anything made from wood would have to be lacquer sealed under pressure to avoid splintering which would negate any natural antibodies wood might contain. But as I have said twice it is an actual understood scientific fact that copper creates an environment that bacteria and viruses cannot live on for any length of time. Why would you be ok with wood because of its natural antibodies that are sealed under lacquer and oppose copper even though it is a proven biostatic?

    Again no offense intended I just wish to understand where you’re very blunt and harsh point comes from? You do however have an excellent point about the comfort issue though, that I will definitely give more thought to. Thanks
     
    Last edited: Nov 23, 2009
  6. Martello

    Martello Member

    You have to be kidding me, did you really just say that? Ok if you want to play a semantics game here you go (as a "Medical Professional" as well as an experienced piercer); I would not consider it safe in insert into a bodily orifice for pleasurable or recreational purposes unless it was made of surgical plastic or surgical steel. And even if those 2 materials are used, they're both still required medical level aseptic cleaning, though I would use surgical aseptic techniques. (glass, if made properly is fine as well, however hold true to the same manor of cleanliness)

    Krills were I am sure you mean well, however, gold, silver, copper and nickel are in some cases have porous surfaces, where which cleaning would be critical to the point where it would not be worth it. Also, some of these metals can impart minerals that can be toxic to the human body as well as a laundry list of allergic reactions. I don't think these are facts that you're considering.

    You asked if there were any health risks you should be made aware of, and yes in fact there are. If you felt like you knew everything already - then why did you ask in the first place exactly?

    Your tone and attitude of your ignorant response with holds no "offense" is in fact offensive and it is intended. I'm not at all comfortable utilizing items created by an (In my opinion) and almost well read metal working hobbyist who's questions he/she feels like they already have all the answers. I would also recommend this attitude for anyone else. Besides the fact that there was a lose comparison between food through the mouth and a possible (subjectively speaking - which can be said the same for foods) can or can not be harmful as well as wiping your ass with bleached paper. Tampons are medically sterile chemically treated wads by the way. Same as a medically sterile gauze that one would bandage a child's knee after a fall. breast implants, which were not always safe actually - are surgical grade surgical sterilized plastic. Real gold in a new piercing as well as silver are recommended to not be used in those cases. I know a number of piercers who would refuse to use it full stop. I'm sure you're aware the a large number of people are in fact allergic yo nickel. Also, I live in NYC where PVC is not up to code for drinking water.

    I apologies if you feel my response was blunt and harsh - in my opinion it's short and to the point. But as we know; the eye of the beholder. It's not up for one person to lent their opinion to someone else regardless of the intent.

    Say and do what you want. you posed a question and I answered you the best I was able with the amount of time I had. Reading your responce - it's my opinion you're not able to correctly address and adult or at least I simply do not liek the way you came off. I'm not checking this thread again. Just be careful and keep reading. You're going to find you might not know everything.
     
  7. Sparrow69

    Sparrow69 Moderator

    The company i work with uses several complex polymers, but most are made with medical grade silicon or latex. However, several advanced products are in the works with some new materials which I'm not sure if I'm allowed to discuss legally.
     
  8. Krills1138

    Krills1138 New Member

    I am not a jerk and i just wanted some friendly advice. Over the years I have learned that certain things need to be said and this is one of those times.

    Since you’re not checking this thread again I will take this as an opportunity to point out to other members and especially to new users why it is so damn hard to become a member of a forum community. If you had the tolerance to read through this mess of a thread then please read the rest of this post and I will break down the conversation. Hopefully it can help you learn to distinguish between people who are intelligent and are really giving useful information and people who just like to talk because they have nothing better to do.

    I did my research and found my facts from creditable sources, and I even linked a few, did you read them? What I was asking for was either advice from someone with actual experience using different materials as sex toys or an intelligent opinion form an actual medical professional.

    Sparrow posted a greatly helpful comment about how he works for a company who ponders the same question. So there is a company experimenting with copper, zinc and other materials. That’s good news and helpful because it is relevant to exactly what I asked and lets me know that yes it is being done. Martello blurted out a half-assed statement then added exceptions to the point where it was no longer true. “unless it's 316MLV do not stick it in you” then he immediately contradicted himself by saying wood was ok, then again in the following post by saying glass is ok and so is surgical plastic. That is just downright confusing, irritating and insulting to an intelligent person. Either surgical steel is the only safe material like he said, or like he said, it is not the only safe sex toy material…. Common WTF is going on there, 316MLV only, or other stuff too?!

    Then we get a stick about cleanliness. Yes, of course you have to clean your toys, but I doubt there is a single person out there who uses surgical aseptic techniques as much I also doubt that the cache of toys on the market are made of surgical grade material.

    Health risks were the exact facts that I was considering, he answers yes, but not really because I still haven’t been given a reason or source. Is copper a bad sex toy material, if so why? What exactly happens, why does it happen, is it only in a small number of people, how likely is it to happen, please give me something here. That is why the question was directed toward a medical pro or someone who has tried it, because I wanted some specifics, not just someone shooting from the hip.

    Then even though I proved I knew what I was talking about he attacks me because I’m only a ”and almost well read metal working hobbyist” That’s fine if you are not comfortable using things I created, I never asked you to and I respect that, but tell me why? Is it because I don’t know what I’m doing? That may be the case but I am trying to learn and shit like this just impedes that. If you consider that to date thousands of products, even children’s toys have been recalled because of faulty manufacturing processes that allowed toxic materials to enter the product and that you might own one of those products. Then you should respect the fact that I am trying to do it myself and attempting to gain the knowledge to be sure we are all safe and protected during sex.

    If you don’t know the answer to a question when someone asks you shouldn’t just make shit up. From a supposed person with medical knowledge you should know the facts!! TAMPONS ARE NOT STERILE BECAUSE THE VAGINA IS NOT A STERILE BODY-CAVITY, AND FOR THE VAST MAJORITY OF WOMEN CONTAINS “GOOD BACTERIA”, THERE IS NO NEED FOR ANY MENSTRUAL DEVICE TO BE STERILIZED. That is a direct wiki quote….

    There is a lot more I could say but it doesn’t seem like it would matter. When someone is trying to join a community and wants some real advice, try to accommodate them. If you don’t know the answer and you just want to state an opinion then state it as an opinion, not a fact. And, for god sake, re-read what you post and fix your grammatical/spelling errors, it makes it very hard to read a post if you are trying to piece together what was supposed to be said.

    Please use this as an example of the difference between good advice (Sparrow) and others who just post random comments because they feel the need to talk. Also don’t forget to fact check what you say and what is said to you, especially when it comes to sex advice. Since I have nothing invested here I’m not sure if I will stick around, good luck to everyone and thanks Sparrow.
     
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2009
  9. Sparrow69

    Sparrow69 Moderator

    since this conversation seems to be so have taken a sour note, and its probably this will turn into a flame war, I have closed it. Lets all be respectable of each other, and remember this lifestyle requires communication and tolerance.

    Furthermore, I'd like to point out Krills that Martello is in fact a Medical professional, and is just as credible as anyone here when it comes to medical implementation and materials usage. Also so that is understood, the company i work with, deals only with medical grade materials, which undergoes rigorous testing to see if the average consumer can clean and sterilize the items and materials without the need of specialized cleaning agents. As of yet, we have not, to my knowledge found a suitable grade of zinc, gold, or silver for a solid item. plating over surgical steel are possible, but wear off.
     
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2009
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