Is it abuse?

Discussion in 'General BDSM discussions' started by Callie, Aug 10, 2010.

  1. Callie

    Callie New Member

    I met an experienced Dom online a year ago. The understanding between us is that we would keep things online only as we were in non-BDSM relationships at home and this was our little escape. Things went on for some time. Mostly happy, some ups and downs. During this time he also made me cut off some online friends he didn't like. We grew very close and sometimes it was more as though we were boyfriend/girlfriend but the sexual activity stopped, despite any attempts I made. Mostly we chatted as friends on email. We both admittted some time back that we had feelings for each other but we left it alone since we were both in relationships. My relationship was coming to an end (and is now). He is unhappy and still in his.

    All of a sudden it starts up again. He's talking dirty, I reciprocate, he pledges his desire for me and hints at putting me in a collar and tells me he wants to meet up, planning how it will all go (we dont live close).

    A few days later I'm given the cold shoulder. When we're online together he doesn't contact me, I have to speak first. Where we used to talk all the time he's now distant and almost cold and abrasive. If I sign into messenger he used to leap to say hello to me now he won't at all. I backed away and left him alone for a while figuring he needed some time or was dealing with issues at home. He gives no explanation. It carried on like this another week so I backed off even further. I got the hint that I wasn't welcome to contact him so often and I respected that and said that I was happy to simply remain friends if thats all he was comfortable with but that was met with a vague excuse about why he isn't talkative right now.

    A sub friend of mine suggested he is an abuser and is doing this so he can then take me back so I'm more under his control. I've been making some life changes and she thinks he is frustrated he isn't more in control of my choices and this is all some mind game. Is she right? I keep questioning and beating myself up for doing something wrong to lose him when things were going so well. Is she right?

    My thoughts were that his personal life is too much right now and he's in a state of confusion or that his feelings for me grew too strong and scared him off but my friends opinion has thrown me.

    I'm not sure whether to cut him off completely. I'm breaking contact for now.
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  2. sebastian

    sebastian Active Member

    Callie, either of the two possibilities seem equally plausible to me, and there's no real way to get more information, because he's not being communicative and even if he were, he might not be honest about what's going on. My advice is that this guy is more trouble than he's worth. You can certainly find other doms out there who will be more responsive to your needs. You may be submissive, but he's not treating you as if you have any value, which is usually a bad sign.
  3. Callie

    Callie New Member

    Thank you. I have begun to see that he doesn't respect my needs at all (shame it took me a year to wake up) and he has a habit of somehow making me feel as though I'm always to blame for everything, if I try and communicate with him he's too tired or just says he's terrible at communicating. He's the first Dom I truly connected with and I'm struggling to let go of that tie but I am finding the strength to walk away, each day that passes I get closer to that and each piece of advice helps me see that its him not me and I need to make the leap.
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  4. sillylittlepet

    sillylittlepet Active Member

    Who wants a dom that isn't honest, open, and responsive?
    This dom isnt worth your time, find someone who is much more willing to communicate. Cut off contact with this guy, he sounds like drama city

    also, just out of curiosity, you have a regular boyfriend and an online dom at the same time?
  5. Callie

    Callie New Member

    I had a vanilla boyfriend who was not interested in anything else. He knew I'm submissive and was agreeable to me having an online Master since he couldn't fulfill my needs (so to speak lol).

    I'll delete his number from my cellphone now. I'm making baby steps to cutting him off, each one painful but required :/
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  6. L8NightQ

    L8NightQ Member

    Hi callie

    I think you guys have covered the obvious, but I'm curious about something.

    When the online relationship started both of you were in vanilla relationships, and now you are out of yours? You've been having trouble with him for a while but how did the timing work?
    Did the two have any thing to do with each other time wise?
    Did you talk about what your plans were after the vanilla breakup?
    How did he know about your other online friends..... you told him, or this was open chat?
    After a while the sex stopped but you guys stayed "friends". You didn't say why it stopped but you must have asked. What did he tell you?

    SLP and Sebastian gave you very straightforward advice and I feel the same way.

    Sometimes we forget that there are really two kinds of people on the web and in chat rooms. Those like you, and those that pretend to be someone else. If you can't get honesty and openness from a friend, they aren't a real friend.

    I can't say I agree with your sub friend about him being an abuser. I don't think his agenda is that sinister. I think he's more of a player and a jerk who just doesn't need you that much any more and hasn't for some time.

    It seems that everyone that tries online relationships goes thru some players and less than honest feeders. Hopefully you'll be more aware of folks like him in the future (they're out there on the streets too).

    I say this because.... He's still online, just not so much with you. This usually means that he has someone else he's focusing on. The relationship took a turn, he reached out to you to fill the void until his other relationship came back on, and now he's cold again. This is standard player activity. You did nothing wrong. He came on to you, remember? And if I read you right, you responded positively.

    The whole thing about him caring to much? Throw that out the window.
    Again.... He's still online, just not with you. If his personal life got that crazy and confused, he wouldn't be online.

    I'm glad you guys never met, and the farther you get away from him, the more transparent he will become.

    By the way..... Welcome to the forum, and don't be a stranger. It sounds like this was your first D/s experience. I'd like to hear more.

    Boyfriend gone, how are you going about looking for Mr. Right now? (currently)
  7. sebastian

    sebastian Active Member

    I like to distinguish between the outer level and the inner level of bdsm. The outer level is the level of external appearance, of the 'scene', and of the rhetoric of bdsm. It's what an outside would see if your play had an audience. The inner level is the level of what's actually happening between the dom and sub, the emotional interactions. On the outer level, the sub is expected to be obedient to the dom's harsh demands. On this level, the sub is often treated as a slave with no rights, a worthless object fit for humiliation and abuse, and the dom often acts as an uncaring asshole who uses the sub purely for his or her own amusement and pleasure. (Yes, obviously many doms and subs play very differently, but in this example, I'm emphasizing the contrast between the levels.) The sub receives all sorts of treatment that he or she dislikes, finds painful, humiliating, and so on. On the inner level, however, the dom and the sub are equals, with the sub making the choice to surrender his or her power to the dom, who has an obligation to respect the sub's needs and limits while meeting her or her own needs. The sub enjoys the treatment he or she is receiving, and finds the unpleasant treatment arousing and satisfying.

    Bdsm becomes unhealthy when the either the dom or the sub start to blur these two levels. A sub needs to remember that his or her submission is voluntary and that he or she has real value. A sub is not actually a slave and is not actually worthless. A dom needs to remember that the sub has needs that must be met, that the sub's consent and limits are important and must be respected, and that the sub needs to be nurtured and cared for (although what that looks like varies from sub to sub and dom to dom). The dom has only as much power over the sub as the sub allows the dom to have.

    Just as one simple example of the difference between the levels, one of the boys I play with loves to be humiliated, insulted, and degraded. He loves having me call him all sorts of names as we play, and the scenes we do inevitably involve me pulling him down and forcing him to accept the abuse. However, the word 'faggot' brings up painful memories of him being gay-bashed years ago. So although on the outer level I revel in humiliating him, I try to avoid calling him a 'faggot' because on the inner level I don't want to cause him real emotional pain. It does slip out occasionally, because it's one of my favorite insults, and when it does, I usually apologize after the scene is over. I realize that I have no true power over him, and I want him to enjoy playing enough that he comes back for more.

    Your dom seems to be blurring the lines between the outer and inner levels by treating you in a way that show he places little value on you and does not respect your gestures of submission and the offering of yourself to him. You can do better than him.
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2010
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  8. L8NightQ

    L8NightQ Member

    Nice way to put it Seb.

    I will remember this. Good example too.
  9. Tumbl3

    Tumbl3 Member

    I agree with L8NightQ, he doesn't sound like an abuser. However, he does sound emotionally manipulative/manipulative in general. Again, I agree that you should cut off all ties, even if it's in baby steps. Hope this helps a little.
    Welcome to the forum, though!
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  10. master jey

    master jey Moderator

    Sounds more like my profile but it applies to him perfectly :)
  11. Callie

    Callie New Member

    Appreciate all the advice I'm getting and thanks for the welcome :). I'm taking the baby steps to remove my ability to contact him so I'm not tempted. He's no longer on my messengers as a contact so he doesn't see me sign in and out and I'm not seeing him sign in and out either so I'm not constantly reminded of Him. Sounds like a small thing but after a year of constant contact its pretty big in my world! These posts really are helping me see his true colors and I'm glad I never met up with Him either. I'm starting to think maybe he only said he had feelings for me so we could meet up for sex and then he goes home to his wife.

    To answer your questions:

    When the online relationship started both of you were in vanilla relationships, and now you are out of yours? You've been having trouble with him for a while but how did the timing work?

    Yes I'm out of mine. He knew my relationship was ending for several months. He was already pulling away from me when my relationship finally broken up.

    Did the two have any thing to do with each other time wise?

    We had made plans to meet but hadn't settled on a date yet.

    Did you talk about what your plans were after the vanilla breakup?

    Sort of. He had already pulled away from me before that. He did ask me if that would mean I was moving to live closer to Him (which I had mentioned I was interested in doing a long time ago, I'd planned it before I met him and it was always on the cards). However I did say that I wouldn't be doing it immediately and it would likely still be months away.

    How did he know about your other online friends..... you told him, or this was open chat?

    They were people he knew also that he disliked. He was angry when I defended them.

    After a while the sex stopped but you guys stayed "friends". You didn't say why it stopped but you must have asked. What did he tell you?

    Not to pressure him and that he wasn't alone at home so it was difficult.

    Boyfriend gone, how are you going about looking for Mr. Right now?

    I'm not. I don't want a new relationship for a while and my next won't be Vanilla ;) I'm taking a loong break from relationships.
  12. Callie

    Callie New Member

    Thanks for taking the time to explain. I am absolutely seeing it now but I was so absorbed before I didn't. I kept telling myself I wasn't good enough for Him.
  13. sebastian

    sebastian Active Member

    And just to continue my analysis, you were blurring the levels as well, confusing the outer level of unworthiness for the inner reality of unworthiness.

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