i don't think i understand punishment

monocrome · Jul 19, 2009

i didnt want to derail marky's "interesting punishments" thread, so i'm putting this here.

i don't think i understand punishment. i don't know why anyone would do anything to get punished and most of the punishments i hear about everywhere in bdsm are things i would happily perform. i think that is likely due to my "devotion" thing, but i have problems discussing punishment and punishment issues everywhere i go b/c i just don't get it. can someone please explain? :-/

Sparrow69 · Jul 19, 2009

its the age old adage that even bad attention is still attention... subs often act up to get their masters to pay them attention when they feel like they aren't getting enough...

or when they know that said master has had a stressful day, and punishing them would relieve said stress... Since a slave/sub usually cant initiate a scene, they do so crtreatively by doing something they know they should not...

it all comes down to the level of devotion really, and how well you pay attention to each other as dom and sub. some subs re inexperienced and make mistakes, and get punished, but sooner or later they know the ropes, and then they intentionally make mistakes to be humbled and punished, as a way of reinforcing their masters view/feeling of their own superiority.

I hope that made sense to you and cleared up some of the confusion. I tend not to repeat myself... unless its accompanied by the crack of a whip

monocrome · Jul 19, 2009

Sparrow69 said:
its the age old adage that even bad attention is still attention... subs often act up to get their masters to pay them attention when they feel like they aren't getting enough...

this makes sense to me, however, i have never understood why one would not just go to their dom/master and address the issue of not getting enough attention. one of the biggest draws of lifestyle bdsm to me is clear cut communication.

or when they know that said master has had a stressful day, and punishing them would relieve said stress... Since a slave/sub usually cant initiate a scene, they do so crtreatively by doing something they know they should not...

here, again, i think i would rather just remind him that i am available as he wishes; soothe the bad day with comforting things, being good, and out of the way; and let him choose if he wants to relieve himself in that way. then again, i suppose it comes down to the type of relationship you have and level of communication. i've already made it infinitely clear to him that i don't have to have done anything "bad" to be told to endure physically trying things... some of the "punishments" i hear about, i am actually given as rewards... maybe it is just a semantics thing with me.

it all comes down to the level of devotion really, and how well you pay attention to each other as dom and sub.

hehe, Mr. Sparrow69, you really are a sadist, slyly questioning my level of devotion b/c i do not understand punishments *winks and smiles jokingly*

honestly, that is what i question or i guess don't understand. if there is communication, devotion and one is paying good attention and being obedient, why would there be a need to be punished or to punish? or is it just that some people enjoy the act of punishing or being punished? maybe i don't understand that part. i, for one, HATE being punished and see it as honest to goodness PUNISHMENT. it's not at all a game to me, which is how i see "punishment" presented a lot.

some subs re inexperienced and make mistakes, and get punished, but sooner or later they know the ropes, and then they intentionally make mistakes to be humbled and punished, as a way of reinforcing their masters view/feeling of their own superiority.

is this a humiliation thing?

and again, everyone, sorry. i have a feeling every single other person here "gets" this but me. so if the questions seem inane, my apologies.

Sparrow69 · Jul 19, 2009

monocrome said:
this makes sense to me, however, i have never understood why one would not just go to their dom/master and address the issue of not getting enough attention. one of the biggest draws of lifestyle bdsm to me is clear cut communication.

and questioning how a master decides to divvy up his time is a punishable offense, and as such you would be punished for doing so...

here, again, i think i would rather just remind him that i am available as he wishes; soothe the bad day with comforting things, being good, and out of the way; and let him choose if he wants to relieve himself in that way. then again, i suppose it comes down to the type of relationship you have and level of communication. i've already made it infinitely clear to him that i don't have to have done anything "bad" to be told to endure physically trying things... some of the "punishments" i hear about, i am actually given as rewards... maybe it is just a semantics thing with me.

i think that any confusion here is on the basis that their is only one form of communication... when you consider that body language and actions make up 95% of our communication, isn't acting out merely a form of telling them you wish to be objectified and used?

hehe, Mr. Sparrow69, you really are a sadist, slyly questioning my level of devotion b/c i do not understand punishments *winks and smiles jokingly*

honestly, that is what i question or i guess don't understand. if there is communication, devotion and one is paying good attention and being obedient, why would there be a need to be punished or to punish? or is it just that some people enjoy the act of punishing or being punished? maybe i don't understand that part. i, for one, HATE being punished and see it as honest to goodness PUNISHMENT. it's not at all a game to me, which is how i see "punishment" presented a lot.

is this a humiliation thing?

Like i said, its all based of the view of communication as a whole. And yes, you'll find most subs do enjoy a good bit of humiliation, whether public or private, and most doms have no qualms about fulfilling that desire... whatever makes you play toys happy.

monocrome · Jul 19, 2009

Sparrow69 said:
and questioning how a master decides to divvy up his time is a punishable offense, and as such you would be punished for doing so...

i do not think it is questioning to state what you feel (unless this has been previously negotiated). the decision is his.

i think that any confusion here is on the basis that their is only one form of communication... when you consider that body language and actions make up 95% of our communication, isn't acting out merely a form of telling them you wish to be objectified and used?

if that is the arrangement, i suppose. i think it is rather dangerous to leave much to assumption... but now this is becoming a discussion about communication, and i still don't understand punishment :-/ it may be something i am not meant to understand. there are many things like that in this life for different people and that is ok

i think, being who i am, if i was with someone who genuinely enjoyed punishing as a give and take play, i would have no problems with doing that for them... i just don't ... understand it. i think, at least for me, the best way to communicate that i want to be objectified and used is by being an object and being available for use (use defined as any little thing from cleaning up to scheduling an appointment to sexual behavior)

Like i said, its all based of the view of communication as a whole. And yes, you'll find most subs do enjoy a good bit of humiliation, whether public or private, and most doms have no qualms about fulfilling that desire... whatever makes you play toys happy.

just to clarify: i was not questioning people's enjoyment of giving or recieving humiliation.

subspace · Jul 20, 2009

monocrome said:
or is it just that some people enjoy the act of punishing or being punished?

I think you answered your own question right here.
Every relationship is unique but I think a good deal of BDSMers are attracted to this aspect. Why else would Master's give order's to their subs that are sometimes impossible to follow?
The great thing about BDSM is how varied and different it is for each D/s, M/s,T/b....yours relationship works perfectly for you so don't worry about not getting the punishment part of it.

pyroaquatic · Jul 20, 2009

Ah, but one may beg for punishment... and it can be a reward. I punish myself on a daily basis but it is a different sort of pleasure.

Martello · Jul 20, 2009

I love when people cut up a post in multiple quotes. It shows that someone is actually reading what you're saying and taking consideration in it. I've been known to do it but ive never seen a conversation held in it.

monocrome · Jul 20, 2009

@subspace - i've never understood Master's giving unattainable orders either. i've always been very clear that i cannot emotionally take that from someone. LOL. i think it would cause some sort of Asmovian "Law of Robotics" reaction within me and make me panic and either try to do the impossible or explode or shut down or something LOOOOOOOOOOL

@ pyroaquatic - yes, it seems like a lot of the things people have listed as punishments are things i recieve either as rewards or as requests during play. but i guess that is sort of the same thing if what subspace says is true and some people just enjoy punishing/punishment AS SUCH. i still don't get that, but i don't have to

just have always wanted to understand

@ Martello - i happen to find it easier for myself and others to read my often longwinded responses if i include the quoted text

subspace · Jul 20, 2009

Monocrome: There was a post earlier about a bell around the neck and not letting it make a sound and it made me think, what happens when/if the bell sounds? What is the point for you and Master if there is no punishment or is it ALL about the task completion. Just curious what happens if you canâ€™t complete what Master has asked of you, do you just discuss it and move on? Curious...

i don't think i understand punishment

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