How do you give them what they want if they don't know what they want?

Discussion in 'General BDSM discussions' started by Gilgland, Dec 17, 2010.

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  1. Gilgland

    Gilgland New Member

    As I have posted in a previous thread I recently got out of a relationship with my first sub due greatly to the fact that she wouldn't communicate with me on her wants and needs. Since then I have talked to and played with a few subs and switches and had a blast and really discovered some great things within myself and the community. That said, I have also found that many people I meet may know on a basic level that they like the idea of submission but they honestly have no clue what they are into past that. When I ask about how the idea of certain activities appeal to them they sometimes can not give me a honest answer even about if it sounds fun or not.

    The question I am now left with is, as a new dominate myself, how do I fulfill the needs, wants, and fantasies of someone who really has no clue what they want? I know starting off slow is very important and that is actually good for me too so that I can learn to judge their reactions to things so that I can better recognize if they like or dislike whatever I am doing to them at that moment, as well as talking about things outside of play, but past that dose any one have any suggestions as far as what to do? I really do not like the trial and error system because I dread the idea of hitting on something that makes them so uncomfortable they either lose trust in me and/or never want to try any sort of play again.

    So far, since my last relationship went south, I have had the good fortune to play with only experienced subs that were able to help me gain a lot of self assurance by both letting me try things I had been uncomfortable with and also talking with me outside of play about how the submissive mindset works and I feel a lot more comfortable with everything now. However, these wonderful people have been only friends and little, if any direct sexual play has been involved with these sessions and when I decide to get into my next relationship I want to be as prepared as possible so that this aspect of the relationship so that both myself and my partner are comfortable and satisfied.
     
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  2. sebastian

    sebastian Active Member

    One thing to do might be to ask your prospective sub what sort of fantasies she has. Ask her to describe them in detail. Then look at the 'moving parts' of the fantasy. Is it about bondage? Humiliation? Rough sex? Torture? Once you've gotten a sense of the major components, try to get a little more specific. If she likes bondage, is it the idea of not being able to move, or the idea of being vulnerable to whatever the dom wants, or the idea of struggling futilely?

    Or ask her about movies or porn she's seen that turned her on, and do the same process. Watch some together and ask her what parts interest her or turn her off.

    Or do a talk scene. Sit down with her and ask her to describe the setting for a sexual fantasy, anything she wants. Then after she's described the setting, narrate how you come into the scene and what you start doing to her. Then let her describe her reaction. Keep trading off like that, with each of your adding something. If you want, do this while stroking each other. After you've done it, talk with her about what parts she might like to play out.
     
  3. Gilgland

    Gilgland New Member

    Thanks Seb. That sounds like really good advice. I just don't want to be stuck in the situation again where I ask "What would you like me to do to you" and all I get back is "You just do what you want and I'll tell you if I like it". Tho that admittedly sounds like an awesome sexual blank check that would be amazing in theory but I know that could easily end in disaster if I try something and we discover one of her hard limits.
     
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2010
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  4. kittengrey

    kittengrey Member

    I know how this is, but I'm unfortunately on the opposite end.
    My master and I are trying to figure out where to go with our relationship, because I like different degrees of different things, but none of them match up and half of them contradict each other.
    The best thing to do is what seb said; ask them ans experiment with things they say they like or hat turn them on if they see it. I'm actually scared when I'm with my master to try the trial and error systems because I don't want to be hurt or fear him. Though I trust him, and I know he won't hurt me, so I had to tell myself that if something happens by accident that I don't like, it happens, and not to freak out about it.
     
  5. Gilgland

    Gilgland New Member

    I understand how frustrating that can be from both ends because how can you know what you like until you try it but at the same time he is looking at it as part of your responsibility in the relationship to at least give him a rough idea of what you like so he has something to work with. A friend of mine quoted a Dome that he once knew that put it beautifully "It is the sub's responsibility to draw the outlines of the picture and the Dom's to paint within those lines".

    I have a hard time just trying things without knowing that my partner will enjoy it for sure, which was my ex's point of frustration with me and in turn I was fed up with her lack of communication about her wants and needs. I think a big part of this stems from the fact that I have had a mother, a past significant other(not the afore mentioned one) and many close female friends that have had sexual abuse in the past and I have seen the result of someone bringing up bad memories from their past and, even tho it was unintentional, it can seriously damage the trust between people if one of their physiological "land mines" is stepped on and I subconsciously think that if I hit a limit with my partner that they will have the same reaction and it frankly frightens me because while I may find erotically hurting someone a thrill I would never want to harm them either mentally or physically. As I believe Seb said in an earlier post "there is a vast difference between hurt and harm, hurting is the fun stuff while harming is actually effecting that person negatively".

    I am working on finding that happy medium between complete inaction because of this phobia and just throwing caution to the wind and doing whatever I please without thought of the other person, and thanks to some good friends it's becoming much easier. For me the relationship comes first, I am a boyfriend before I am that persons Dom and I am very loving and caring and concerned for that person's well being. All of that said I really think that if communication is open and honest both parties can find what they both like and be very happy. I am just looking for ideas on how to do that more effectively so that whoever I find myself with in the future and I will be able to safely explore this wonderful side of ourselves.
     
    Last edited: Dec 18, 2010
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  6. sebastian

    sebastian Active Member

    I'll bet that was L8 who said that; credit where credit is due. The difference between bdsm and abuse is that in bdsm the person getting hit can stop it whenever s/he wants.

    How's this? When you spank, paddle, flog, etc your sub, establish that after the first strike, she has to say "thank you, Sir. May I have another? You won't strike until she says it. That lets you know to keep going and lets her control the pacing. When she wants you to increase the force, she says "May I have another, more harsh?" Play this game until you've learned her limits and reactions. Then agree that you're in control of the force but she gets the timing. Eventually, try one where you get complete control and trust that she will safeword. Use the streetlight colors and do periodic color checks.
     
  7. Gilgland

    Gilgland New Member

    It very well could have been L8. You and he have both given me a lot of valued advice.

    That actually sounds great. I guess that also will let me see her reactions and body language so I can learn them and be able to tell how she's doing with out as much verbal feed back as time goes on.
     
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  8. princedorian

    princedorian Member

    When I became a slave, me and my Master had literally hours of conversations on the topic of preferences, boundaries, expectations, etc. I think it's best to communicate from the very beginning, to avoid misunderstandings and awkward situations. I wouldn't feel comfortable doing sth I dont want to, but saying "no" to my Master also seems awkward. Anyway, In a period of roughly three weeks, we worked out our "routine", which is based on compromises. Within these boundaries, I can serve my Master with joy and sense of fulfillment. We still do experiment, though
     
  9. Gilgland

    Gilgland New Member

    Thanks prince. That sounds like you and your master have really good communication. That is exactly what I hope to happen in my future relationships. I guess in the future I just need to look for someone who is willing to be open enough to tell me what they are interested in trying as well as discussing things of that nature early on.

    Tho it would be ideal to find a significant other that already has a pretty good handle on what they are interested in, I am trying to prepare for being with someone who may not have any experience with BDSM past curiosity and fantasy so that the relationship begins with that honesty and communication and hopefully continues in that fashion, with experimentation with new curiosities as they arise, so that both she and I can fully explore each others fantasies to their fullest.
     
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2010
  10. TwistedSister

    TwistedSister New Member

    When I found out I liked and wanted to submit, it was my Dom who dispeled many of of the untruths that I had understood. He and I talk. And talk. Ad Nauseum. Not really, but we do talk a lot about my wants and needs. I thought that strange, because after all, I was here to serve, no? Well part of His enjoyment as a Dom is to make sure His sub is happy. It was uncomfortable for me at first, but I am learning how to tell him if I want something. To be honest, I will ask if I can cum. I ask this mostly when we are apart and I would like a little stress relief. Communication I think may be the key ...
     
  11. Gilgland

    Gilgland New Member

    If you don't mind me asking Twisted, what were some of the misconceptions you had the he helped you clear up?

    I am very similar to your Dom in that even tho I like to be in control, what makes me happy, when all is said and done, is knowing I made my partner happy. That may sound kind of backwards to some, and admittedly I was very confused by that for a long time but I realized that the nature of power exchange is kind of circular. The Dom is in charge but when the sub is actually the one with the most power because as soon as the safe word is said everything stops. My paradox that I finally had to accept is that it is ok, as a Dom, to actually put my partner's wants, needs, fantasies and desires before my own, but I then realized that the way a sub often gets gratification is doing exactly what their Dom wants them to. For a long time I questioned if I was actually dominate at all until I figured that out. I knew I wanted to be the one in control but my feelings of wanting to please my partner first and foremost seemed to conflict with that until I realized that taking that position of dominance was exactly what a submissive person finds pleasure in.
     
    Last edited: Dec 22, 2010
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