He called me "sir"

Discussion in 'General BDSM discussions' started by rooluvr, Jan 6, 2012.

  1. rooluvr

    rooluvr New Member

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    Hi, all. I'm new to this and unsure where the rabbit hole leads, but I am looking forward to the journey. I guess I have a lot of questions, but really I think what I need to do is normalise my experience against those going through similar things. That's what I'm here for! There's a lot more detail to the story, but I'll start out nice and simple.

    A few weeks ago I took a friend of mine out to dinner (we're both gay). We've known each other for a year or so, but since he was in a relationship we've just been friends. Anyway, 4 months after he and his boyfriend broke up we're exchanging shy glances across the dinner table, hours later it's a furtive kiss on the couch and a record breaking 30 seconds thereafter that it's game on in the bedroom.

    I already had an inkling that he had a bit of a foot fetish. Common enough, some might even say pedestrian (LOL). I played into that a little but as the love making progressed it became clear that he wanted me to be more controlling than is customary. I played along, pinning him down as best I could. I found this all quite ironic considering he's physically stronger and so could easily physically subdue me if he so chose. He even requested my permission before he achieved orgasm, which I found kind of cute.

    Now, I flatter myself to think I am pretty adaptable in the bedroom but this is something I am completely unfamiliar with. He recently confessed to me that he'd very much like to be "tied up" though he has never tried it before. Needless to say I have a lot to learn. Like any keen student I hit the books. I bought Jay Wisemen's excellent book on bondage and started reading up on ropes, safety and general BDSM concepts.

    I guess my very first insecurity / concern is that Jay refers to the person in the submissive role as the "bottom" and the dominant as the "top". In gay parlance, though, I see myself as the "bottom" (I like to be penetrated). Besides which, this guy considers himself a "top" (someone who likes to penetrate). I am content that physical roles and emotional / mental roles are quite different things and someone can be a "dominant bottom" and a "submissive top" but I just have difficulty understanding the logistics. How do I (or should I even) compel someone who is bound to roger me? Especially since I fear he's someone who may easily go limp if distracted.

    Also, like anyone, I don't really want to have to do all the work, I would like, on occasion, to be the one getting all the attention as it were, rather than the other way around. I think I understand the paradox of the submissive role in that because it's only through the sub's consensual submission that the top has any control at all, it's actually the sub who has all the power in the scene. I guess I'd like a little power myself.

    My other insecurity is that I actually really do like this guy, he ticks all the boxes and so I don't want to mess up the opportunity for a relationship. I don't want for him to look back in 6 months time and think "oh yeah, that was the time I thought I'd try getting tied up by so-and-so. Oh boy was that a mistake!"

    Anyway, nice to be here and hello to everyone.
  2. JettOnly

    JettOnly Member

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    Hello rooluver
    Heres my 2p worth :D

    Basically any book or other person or whatever else is only saying what THEIR experience is.
    Your experience is going to be based on what the two of you like

    No act is dominant or submissive, you can control sex by telling him exactly what to do. also you dont have to have the actual sex as part of the scene - it can be kind of aftercare afterwards - when your guy is tied up he is at your mercy to do anything you want to him :D

    Reading and research is really great, it helps loads
    Talking to your partner is way more important. Keep having chats with him, ask him to explain what he thinks a good scene would look like and see what you like the sound of
    Think about what you really want, what gets you going and think about how you can tell him to do it
    You could think up a scene where you rollplay something, like a cop harrasing a prisoner, a boss with and employee - anything you fancy

    BUT dont do things you are not sure about just to please a new partenr. Talk about things, start small and talk about them again, see how it goes, see what you enjoy

    have fun, really there are no rules
  3. sebastian

    sebastian Active Member

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    Hey, roo, nice to meet another friend of Dorothy on this site.

    Read through the Newcomer's FAQ. There's a lot there that I think can help you sort through some of your confusion. It's good that you bought Wiseman; he has a lot of good guidance.

    A couple thoughts:
    1) It's not strange at all that your guy who likes being dominated is physically strong. It's very common for people to want to experience the other side of their particular coin. Strong guys like being tied up and struggling; socially dominant guys like being humiliated; really masculine guys enjoy being feminized. BDSM is about putting down your normal social status and experiencing the opposite status. It can be like a rest break during a workout or a sporting event; it helps re-energize you for normal life.
    2) 'Top' and 'bottom' started life as BDSM terms that were adopted by the general gay community to refer to anal sex. Many in the BDSM world, however, use those terms to indicate power positions in certain forms of play. One can be a bondage top or a flogging bottom. It is possible for an anal bottom to be the dom. If you want your boy (the general term for a submissive gay man) to fuck you, order him to fuck you. Tell him what position he's gonna use, tell him how fast or slow you want it, and so on. Being the dom is about being in control and calling the shots, not who is the active partner in a particular act (although the top is often the active partner). Many doms enjoy being tied up or tortured occasionally.

    As far as being the one doing the work, it's true that the dom has more work to do in many ways, but I think of being dominant as being selfish altruistically. Subs like to service, so by lying back and demanding that a boy suck my cock, I'm being selfish (my cock is getting sucked and the boy is doing the work), but I'm being selfish in an altruistic way (the boy is getting what he wants, which is to be of service to me).

    Let me offer a story that might help clarify the dynamic. Back when I was vanilla, I was in an 8-year marriage. I was very focused on my ex's needs (that's the way I am), and my ex was very focused on his needs (that's the way he is). So I was being altrustic, and he was being selfish, and no one was looking out for what I needed. He eventually cheated on me and left me, and I eventually discovered BDSM. Being dominant works very well for me because it allows me to be altruistic (I'm meeting my boy's needs), but it allows me to be selfish (because I can demand that my boy meet my needs). I have to pay a lot of attention to what my boy needs, how to train him, and so on, but he has to do a lot of work for me to meet my needs (I get sex when I want it, how I want it, he does chores for me, and so on). Does that help explain things?

    Anyway, stick around. This site needs more polesmokers.
  4. rooluvr

    rooluvr New Member

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    Thank you for your reply!

    Yeah, he's away on holiday at the moment, but when I get some quiet time with him we'll have a long discussion about hard and soft limits and the sorts of things we want out of this. I understand it's really important and it makes sense =D

    We are family! I have read through the FAQ and to be honest, I was specifically hoping you would respond since I get the sense you'd understand where I am coming from. Thank you for replying!

    1) Hey, you know that makes perfect sense. He has expressed that he'd be inclined to struggle. I guess my responsibility is to ensure he can't get free too easily, this is something I am putting some thought into. Since I am inexperienced I have to balance his desire to be completely immobilised against my concerns for his safety.

    He's also asked to be gagged. I'm not entirely sure it's safe for the first time. If I do gag him though, how does one have a safe word if one can't speak?

    2) Yeah, I'm happy with the terms, but I guess it's still the logistics of it that I find confusing.

    Let's say I have him tied up, wrists together, arms above the head to the top of the bed. Spread-eagled. Seems reasonable enough, I have read that I shouldn't go overboard with restraints on the first time. I'd probably want to keep his legs free and perhaps immobolise his hips somehow but then *blush* I mean, how would I get him to *ahem* mount me from that position?

    I mean, I expect that the cowboy / reverse cowboy position should work fine, but that's relatively limited. Maybe I am just over-thinking things?

    3) Yes, the altruistic selfishness thing makes sense. I empathise a lot with the being taken advantage of experience. I like to take care of people, I see myself as something of a nurturing person. In my opinion you have to really care for someone's wellbeing to be willing to tie them up. I'm still a little concerned that if I tie him up that's going to be great fun for him but just a load of unrewarding work for me. I guess I need to discuss control with him before hand and make it clear that if I'm going to all the trouble of immobilising him, he's going to hav to do as I say :p

    Agreed! I am here for the boy, so if he doesn't last I can't promise I will be able to maintain my enthusiasm. I will do my best to contribute while I am here though =D
  5. sebastian

    sebastian Active Member

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    Keep in mind that you're both just learning about BDSM. You don't need to master it all in a week. Total immobalization is somewhat advanced as bondage goes. I've had very good training by a bondage mentor and I'm still not really very good at full immoblization. So take it slow. Learn how to spread-eagle him, and learn how to tie his wrists and ankles. Play around with those. Then add a little more to the mixture.

    Anal topping while tied is pretty tough--about the only position I can imagine is mounting someone who's spread-eagled. So you need to get creative. Do a role-playing scene where he's a straight celebrity and you're a deranged fan who wants him to fuck you. You spread-eagle him and suck him hard and then mount him, all while he's begging you to stop. Or make him fuck you, and only after you're satisfied with the fucking does he get to be tied up to his heart's delight. Or he's your prisoner, you tie him up and torture him, and then at some point he gets loose and fucks you to get revenge. And remember, as the sub, he doesn't get everything he wants every time you play--make him fuck you tonight, and do all your chores tomorrow, and then tie him up as the reward. As he's fucking you, periodically tell him what you're going to do when you tie him up tomorrow--that should help him keep his enthusiasm going. You don't need to do fucking and bondage in the same session. I rarely do anal when I tie up a boy. You're the dom, so make sure that any scene you do is about your needs getting met and him rewarded for meeting those needs.

    Gags are pretty easy to do, just don't do the sock-in-the-mouth style gag if he's tied up--it can be fairly easy for the sub to choke on those. And there are lots of cheap ball and bit gags online that you can buy. Very few gags actually prevent the sub from speaking--they just prevent him from speaking clearly. So he should still be able to grunt 'red' or whatever your safeword is. But you can also do a standard safe gesture: he shakes his head back and forth and grunts 'uh-uh' until you notice.

    One way to cut down on the amount of work that tying a sub involves is to buy some decent leather bondage toys. These are fairly safe if used properly, quick to apply, and give moderate immobilization, especially if you start combining them. Wrist shackles don't give you total immobilization, but if you combine them with arm binders the immobilization factor rises quickly. Combine them with an under-the-bed bondage system and you can get him spread-eagled in five minutes. Combine them with a hood and he's going to start feeling helpless because he can't see what you're about to do to him. Combine them with a spreader bar and he's going to feel exposed and humiliated.
  6. rooluvr

    rooluvr New Member

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    Thanks for that, I will have to keep reminding myself of this. I am not used to being the one demanding things. It's ironic that my last boyfriend complained that he wanted me to be "more assertive" in the bedroom. Perhaps this is a lesson life is very keen on teaching me at the moment. I look forward to learning.

    And thanks for the idea with buying the ready-made stuff, I guess I got distracted by the ropes and knots but there are some pretty nice accessories out there. Like I said in the other thread, I got some lovely wrist and ankle cuffs and an under the bed system, kind of like a second Christmas. I hope they arrive in country before he does!
  7. sebastian

    sebastian Active Member

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    It's a challenge, if you're a naturally nurturing guy, to be assertive. It takes practice. Keep reminding yourself that it's what your bf wants. So have lots of conversations where you map out what turns him on, give him a safe word and then trust him to use that safe word, which means that until he does, you'e got a lot of room to do what you want. After playing, ask him what he liked best, what he wanted more of, and one thing you could have done better.

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